The Camping Forum

[CrazyCamper]

Oh boy - another thread that's had me wondering where it all comes from?

OK - the title: "What makes a tent good in bad weather" sounds plausible enough, so you would think it would lead to reasonable discussion on how to ensure a tent (ANY tent, ANY brand etc) is pitched as best as can be for starters

We're all buying tents that suit our needs, size / make / budget mean that wherever you look there is a huge variety of tents out there... and they would all stand a reasonable chance of surviving bad weather fine if they are attached to terra firma with pegs that are suitable / guy ropes that are correctly routed etc etc (I'm sure you all know what I mean so no sermon from me on how to do that )

Looking at my own "camping on 2 wheels" thread as an example of this - my rather cheap Lichfield Dome tent took a verified Force 9 gale with associated very heavy rain on a campsite within 100m of the sea in South West Wales. It did blow down but remained firmly pegged in (looking at the primitive 2 cross pole design it's hardly surprising that the high winds flattened it) and the water ingress was only down to the entrance door flap now being horizontal which was letting water in from above..... The next morning that very same tent was re-erected and stayed in use on that trip until my other kit had dried. That same tent saw continued service until I chose to replace it with a slightly bigger tent. I have camped in extreme weather in tents not really designed for the worst, and yet they did the job? No need to abandon camping in a tent - no need to fear the worst - and no need to make new campers feel that their investment isn't suitable for their holiday.....

This forum is here to advise, I'm happy to pass on any knowledge I have from experience to someone asking - especially those new to campering; as I would rather they take to camping safe in the knowledge that they can erect their tent safely, enjoy the experience no matter what the weather, and report back on here how surprised they were that their 'adventure' more than lived up to their expectations thanks to help from here

[Admin]

I think the topic here is not one as the topic title but like the other recent posts you have made Rex and that's just to stir things up.. don't get me wrong you have some usefully information and some great posts but just recently its all the same Rex and certainly seems to be just to upset which is a real shame..

Thing is I and others mods included defended you when we were threaten'd with legal action from aerial shack and they insisted we remove everything.

I was insistant that we did not and only clarify the details with yourself. In the end you edited yourself but I'm kind of feeling left with a little sour taste in my mouth with your recent very clearly calculated posts.

I'm going to leave it at that now go away and think about things and what we should as at the moment I feel we should remove these posts but will think it over

Andy

Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk

That is your prerogative Andy. When members become personnel because of their lack of knowledge then it is time for me to say Good By to you all.I have enjoyed my stay and think you have a good forum but as I am now a Tin Tenter I will join a caravan forum were I can learn about caravans and spend more time over the Atlantic were debate does not become personal and debaters must prove what they say as substance. http://forums.techguy.org/controversial ... tch-8.html
Best regards to you all on this forum.
Rex.

Rex, Have taken this offline and PM'd you. I'm not trying to but wanted to be sure you dont feel I was being personal in anyway.

Thanks

Andy

[JohnH]

Sorry but about another canvas is great thread. I'm more than happy with my cheapo tents that have so far managed to keep my dry and have remained in shape and placement in some very stormy weather.
If I was going to spend £2-3k on a tent, it wouldnt be a tent, it would be a caravan or time-share for that amount!

[nutgone]

I think people do get carried away with HH ratings, as they don't actually tell you anything about the mechanical strength of a material (& I think "GearWeAre.com" have got their figures slightly out with what they believe this equates to in real life terms, I doubt even a hurricane could push water through 2000mmHH, but I could be wrong)

I love my Cabanon canvas tent (£62 from ebay) but it is bloody heavy, & very bulky to carry around.

On the flip side of the coin, I had the time of my life last year in France, I spent 5 weeks, non-stop camping in a fantastic little Regatta dome tent I got from Argos for £35.

Most tents that get wrecked in high winds simply weren't put up properly in the first place. I see it all the time, guy ropes still coiled up from the factory, poles & material not stressed correctly, pegs pushed in at the wrong angle, or bent over with a heavy boot because no one thought to buy a mallet.
That's why tents fall down in high winds (my opinion).

You don't need to spend a fortune to camp in a safe tent (that one is fact, I think )

If push came to shove, I expect my Cabanon frame tent would last lnger than the Regatta dome tent, but if the wind was up to those sorts of speeds it would be completely immaterial anyway, as I would be in my car, loking for a hotel or some kind of safe building to shelter the storm in. Not sat in my tent, wondering what baufort scale this particular storm was blowing at!

Sorry I've dug this one up, I had resisted looking at it until now. I blame the lot of you for not writing more posts for me to look at when I'm bored & can't sleep!

[alandkell]

OH my god! what the hell went on here?? rexgrant you clearly are an antagonist,banging on about things to create argument is all i can see from your thread i am a novice where camping is concerned, but reading your post has truly made a difference to the way i think about how the wind and rain will affect my tent! NOT! Please dont just get a caravan get a life mate!

[Wayne]

I think people do get carried away with HH ratings, as they don't actually tell you anything about the mechanical strength of a material (& I think "GearWeAre.com" have got their figures slightly out with what they believe this equates to in real life terms, I doubt even a hurricane could push water through 2000mmHH, but I could be wrong)

That's right the HH rating on a tent has nothing to do with integrity/strength of the tent. It is purely a reading of how waterproof the tent is, nothing more and nothing less.

The rating on the Coleman Event Shelter is 450mm and we are told on here from owners that whilst it can hold back drizzle it leaks when exposed to heavy showers.

I had a Rage tent and at the time it claimed to be 2000mm (although I have doubts), when we were hit by heavy storms it leaked in all over the place, the water was literally pushing through the material and forming on the inside as constant drips.

I use the HH rating as a valuable indication of how waterproof a tent is, if the HH rating for a tent could not be given to me then I wouldn't give it a second look. Obviously I exclude Cotton and Pollycotton which don't have HH ratings because of the nature of the material.

I would never assume a HH of 5000mm means the tent is solid in strength, but just that its very resilient against water. Nothing a manufacturer can tell me about a tent will indicate the Integrity of the tent. To do that I have to go and see a tent set up, especially if its windy. I purchased the Coleman Mackenzie cabin 6 because of how it was performing in heavy winds at a camp show.

[nutgone]

I just picked up this little gem from the caravan & camping club FAQ pages:

Hydrostatic head is the measure of resistance that the tent fabric has to a column of water penetrating it. In other words, its waterproofness. When choosing a tent there are two considerations, the waterproofness of the flysheet and the groundsheet. The flysheet is exposed to the rain and the wind, but tests have shown that even in the worst conditions, a hydrostatic head of 800mm is sufficient to prevent rain being forced through the fabric. However, the level of waterproofness of a tent will fall as it is used, hence the lowest level I would recommend you purchase is 1,500mm for a flysheet. A groundsheet needs to be able to withstand much higher levels of water pressure as when you walk across a groundsheet or kneel on it, especially on wet ground the pressure can be equivalent to a water column of 3,000mm or more. Hence for a family tent, I would suggest 5,000mm is the minimum you should be looking for. In the manufacture of lightweight tents the waterproof coatings on groundsheets can be enhanced with additional finishes, such as a silicone treatment, or are reduced to decrease the weight of the tent.

Looks quite similar to something Rex posted earlier, but with slightly different figures IIRC

Just out of idle curiosity, does anyone know the exact specifics of the water column test?

Yes, I know it's a water column, but what is the diameter of it? Is there any specifics about how the material is attached to it?

Of all the camping info I've ever read I've never actually found this out. I think I even googled it once.

[Wayne]

Just out of idle curiosity, does anyone know the exact specifics of the water column test?

I've often wondered that, I have a vision in my head how it could be achieved, but I imagine its done with pressure, rather than an elongated glass tube 10M long or even more

[CrazyCamper]

The testing seems to vary from auto machines or manually set-up testing from what I've seen via Google? I have found a Youtube video showing just one example, and it did surprise me how the testing is carried out as I almost expected giant columns of water too

[nutgone]

It's been such a long time since I did any engineering. I'm not so sure that the diameter of the column makes any difference. Sure, a wider diameter column is obviously heavier, but the weight of that water is spread over a much larger piece of material. & gravity is constant anyway (9.18 m/s/s IIRC)

I dunno. So I've posted it as a question on Yahoo Answers (they've never let me down yet).

I will, of course, report back. (like anyone's really that bothered )

[M0KAS]

but being tested under pressure would it give different results under gravity???, the elephant and the stiletto principle, (pressure and surface area on ground).

and whatever material he was using only lasted to 60cm, so was that a good tent or a bad tent, if its only a 600mm hight on a piece of material, it a kinda naff tent lol..

[badger]

Damn i missed the party??? . Thats the most heated debate i have ever seen on here... Good on the Mods/admin Back to the topic... Its a weird one because i have used a tent with 1500HH and its 'weathered the storm' (soz bad pun ). At the same time i have used a Litchfield dome with 3000HH and that has been great but there was once when it leaked a little bit? I thought it was due to the age of the tent (3 yrs old) and so i decided to get a new one. I couldn't get the new tent in time for a trip with friends so i took the 'Litchfield' and was fearing the worst after last time!!! The weather was worse than the time when it leaked but it was fine??? I always pitch it correctly so my only conclusion was wind speed/how long it rained/what type of rain? (ok yea... type of rain )
No i havn't worked for British Rail..... . I just think lots more factors come into it with your tent in bad weather...like are you slightly sheltered(a wall,hedge,building),Which part of the tent is facing the wind? And don't forget the all important one? Did i spill beer in the tent after i went to sleep and now im convinced its leaking

[JohnH]

I think its 1mm cube of water